Suggestion: Max Values

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Joined: Tue May 05, 2009 7:34 pm

Re: Suggestion: Max Values

Post by hoho » Fri Jan 15, 2010 1:10 pm

After talking to a few guildies last night I found out there are several people who have been uploading logs to WMO simply for the fact they show max hits/crits there but they can't see it on WoL. So I guess for some people seeing max values is quite important.

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Re: Suggestion: Max Values

Post by Cookiee » Sun Jan 17, 2010 6:54 am

There are a couple of meaningful uses for this, that were sadly not stated here at all.

1. For damage taken to tanks. Average is nice for damage intake, but realistically it's usually the big enraged hits that kill tanks. For example Festergut getting his full stack of buffs and destroying your tank. You kind of want to be able to compare how hard the boss hits the tanks, and what type of hits they are taking during that time. You can usually figure this out on your own through the damage taken graphs, but it would just be nicer to see how big the hits are that some of these tanks are taking. Main reasoning for this is to find ways to avoid these big hits, and try to figure out the proper usage of cooldowns versus these attacks.

2. For dps there are different reasons for seeing the max hits. Id rather see them to find out if the dps is using their cooldowns at proper times. Someone having a 15k arcane blast vs someone with a 30k arcane blast and etc might show certain things. On the graphs you see spikes like on icehowl, but you don't really know what the person is doing or how hard he is hitting during that time unless you look through the raw log.

3. Probably not so useful reasons as already put in this top is just to see big numbers. Obviously this is pretty much useless and cosmetic.

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Re: Suggestion: Max Values

Post by hoho » Mon Jan 18, 2010 12:58 pm

Seeing median values would also be quite useful, not just averages and min/max. Though that would definitely stretch the page width quite a lot.

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Re: Suggestion: Max Values

Post by Maihem » Mon Jan 18, 2010 1:25 pm

Hmm, maybe some dynamic table implementation allowing you to toggle column visibility... Eek, so much to do :-(

Seriously though, I'm not adding more columns (especially those with limited usefulness) without some way of switching them on and off. The table will just become *way* too bloated.

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Re: Suggestion: Max Values

Post by hoho » Mon Jan 18, 2010 3:35 pm

I remember good-old wws used to enable turning a few columns (in)visible via JS. Basically on UI-side all you'd need is a button to open a small dialog window with a bunch of ticks for each column. Obviously on server-side you'd still need to actually calculate the numbers for display :)

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Re: Suggestion: Max Values

Post by caecus » Thu Feb 04, 2010 1:04 am

I'm a big fan of this feature on other logging sites, although I found the constant need to check multiple boxes on multiple rows (for every play I went to) on WWS to be annoying.

I feel a better way for WoL to do this would just be to show only the totals of each column by default (instead of the current #/avg/total), and then allow per category expansion (where categories are hits/crits/ticks/tick crits/etc), to see the details.

Made a few mockups to communicate this better (data is garbage, and my paint skills suck, but columns should give you an idea what I mean).

Collapsed columns (standard when you go to a details page):

Clicking on the hit details you'd get something like:

Ideally you could expand as many you want and make the table huge (if you so desired). I haven't done any client side webscripting in a long time, but I'd imagine this is all pretty straightforward (WoL already does expandable rows on the main damage done screen for pets/etc ).

Anyway, just thought I'd try and make a contribution to this awesome site!

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Re: Suggestion: Max Values

Post by dalroi » Sun Nov 28, 2010 2:33 pm

[quote="Maihem"Current numbers are count/avg/total for hit/block/crit/crush/glance/tick hit/tick crit. Do you need min/max? For each of these?

Seeing as min/max aren't directly related to total/count = avg, I suppose these people are actually more interested in seeing a statistical analysis of the distribution of these numbers?
Smells like a new graph to me.

A graph like that would show the distribution of some quantity (damage done, for example), with the amount on the X-axis and the number of occurrences on the Y-axis. Marking average, 1 times and 2 times standard deviation would be nice.

I'd expect a normal distribution for fights where the situation remains constant (Patchwerk, for example), but in other situations that distribution gets skewed because there are adds, damage reduction buffs/debuffs, etc.